Sonus 2605 vs Wharfedales

i own an sr5500.ur receiver has high current capability.still i think it will be little difficult to drive the wharfies at 86db sensitivity.
Use the digital inputs instead of the analog ones..ive tried in mine and the sound improved !! .
i use a 400rs coaxial cable[chinese..but good quality]

High current capability is the power supply design combined with other design factors which makes an amp capable of instantaneous spurts of power with demanding music passages even at high volumes with difficult speaker loads.

The 4pr is from kimber kable.
http://www.kimber.com/

thanks neono and sq_wave...

WIll go for a digital coaxial cable soon...

Any suggestions on biwiring and biamping.. which would be better?

thanks

nimz

For biwiring you need more cables
For biamping you need more Amp (& cables)

Forget bi-wiring/bi-amping for now. Try and get the best single wire that you can afford.

Bi-Amping will need another power amp. If you are going that direction, you will have to replace your reciever also with another matching power-amp/integrated for this make any sense.

Suggestion for speaker wire for Marantz/Wharfedale combo:

QED Silver Anniversary.

Go for the single wire version. Ask for a few inches more, use those extra inches to replace the current jumpers. You WILL notice a difference! I did.

But first, burn-in! 100 hours and you're done. Yes they will sound a lil dull initially but it's worth the wait. Wharfedale Diamond 8 series has a lovely mid-range. Enjoy it. It's very easy getting used to.

thanks Sq_wave and Shahrukh...

well now i shall concentrate on running them beauties in and get a good co axial and spkr cables...

And declare this unnecessarily long thread closed...

Im not sure whether u can biamp wth ur receiver.u can do that in denon receivers. .i think.u cant...

square_wave schrieb:

Been there , done that ! Any speaker regardless of their price needs to be carefully placed to perform best. I was talking about the inherent cabinet resonance and boom of the wharfedales. It has nothing to do with positioning of the speakers. Whatever you do, the boom and resonance from the cabinet is not gonna go away unless you do some heavy bracing. All you can do is reduce the boom created by the primary reflections by moving the speakers into the room and adjusting them but most people will be restricted due to the size of their listening area and other factors.

You talk like u have built ur own speaker..
well i have and heavy bracing ain't going to do jack $hit if u don't know how much bracing to put and where to put.. and what type of bracing to use....and bracing is just one of the many methods employed to reduce boom and cabinet resonances..bracnig is also done to help keep in check one more important and detrimental effect caused to the drivers when put in speaker enclosres..

U fail to consider the fact that these are 20k comercial speakers..
of couse m speakers cost me 12k to build..
but i went the DIY way and could build it the way i wanted it..

when i said that it would work well for him i was saying it considering the size of his room..
though the acoustics would be different the dimensions are prety clsoe to my present room dimensions and the diamonds perform best in their present room.

am sorry i don't agree about the boom...while design may have consequences on the way a spekers sound(even boomy) put them in a corner and most spekers will sound boomy.. ...u claim that u spend so much time with prithvi..do urself a favour..learn something from him...
put ur spekers in a corner or aganstn a wall and i would call u deaf if u don't hear the speakers boom.

Im sorry Nimz,i just went through the marantz user guide.You can Biamp.Even thogh Marantz says nothing about biamping, in their user guide , you can biamp using 2 methods.

1) Using the multiroom option.[Using,left and right surround BACK speakers]
2) Using Multichannel stereo[Provided,you are not using the left and right surround speakers]

Its better to use the 2nd method[multichannel stereo] in my opinion.You can turn on biamping by a switch in the remote.In this mode,the front Lt and Rt signals are sent to the
Surr Lt and Rt channels without any additional processing.

If you choose multiroom speaker,then you have to activate it through the front panel switch,Then you have to select the source,Then the seperate volume level....too many steps.

would advise against biamping or biwiring for now nimz...just enjoy the music while the speakers burn in..

Savyasaachi schrieb:

square_wave schrieb: Been there , done that ! Any speaker regardless of their price needs to be carefully placed to perform best. I was talking about the inherent cabinet resonance and boom of the wharfedales. It has nothing to do with positioning of the speakers. Whatever you do, the boom and resonance from the cabinet is not gonna go away unless you do some heavy bracing. All you can do is reduce the boom created by the primary reflections by moving the speakers into the room and adjusting them but most people will be restricted due to the size of their listening area and other factors. You talk like u have built ur own speaker.. well i have and heavy bracing ain't going to do jack $hit if u don't know how much bracing to put and where to put.. and what type of bracing to use....and bracing is just one of the many methods employed to reduce boom and cabinet resonances..bracnig is also done to help keep in check one more important and detrimental effect caused to the drivers when put in speaker enclosres.. U fail to consider the fact that these are 20k comercial speakers.. of couse m speakers cost me 12k to build.. but i went the DIY way and could build it the way i wanted it.. when i said that it would work well for him i was saying it considering the size of his room.. though the acoustics would be different the dimensions are prety clsoe to my present room dimensions and the diamonds perform best in their present room. am sorry i don't agree about the boom...while design may have consequences on the way a spekers sound(even boomy) put them in a corner and most spekers will sound boomy.. ...u claim that u spend so much time with prithvi..do urself a favour..learn something from him... put ur spekers in a corner or aganstn a wall and i would call u deaf if u don't hear the speakers boom.

Sorry. Tried everything but it still does not cure the cabinet resonance due to very cheap cabinet build as it is a 20k commercial speaker. The cabinet resonance affects the quality of the bass too which was irritating to say the least.
You fail to understand the difference between room resonances and cabinet resonance and the fact that most speakers must work within an existing space or one that has been designed with things other than acoustics in mind.

GUys..

a lovely weekend spent with my speakers...

things are beginning to open up...

saachi, in my room the speakers dont boom.. i have it abt 1.5 feet or more from the walls..and toed in and even bad recordings / TV source I dont find any boom!!

I love the soundstagin especially wen listening to jazz/instrumental and light tamil cine music..

The diamonds suit my tastes...!!!!

Thanks neono.. i too looked up the manual.. but 4600 doesnt have the multi room option.. considering the advice against bi-wotevering the spkrs... atleast for the time being am not gonna do it..

Keep rocking!!!

Nimz

nimz schrieb:

The diamonds suit my tastes...!!!! Keep rocking!!! Nimz

Shahrukh schrieb:

Wharfedale Diamond 8 series has a lovely mid-range. Enjoy it. It's very easy getting used to.

Told you so!!

hey shahrukh, how are the KEFs coming along...

In what areas are they different from the DImaonds u had?

I guess u had the same equipment / room for both..

DOes the Uni-Q arrangement have a conspicous effect on sound reproduction?

Do Let us all know!!!

Nimz

Hi Nimz,
Good to know that you are enjoying your speakers.It is very important to find speakers that suit your tastes. Good to know that you have found one that gives you happiness.
Keep rockin.....

nimz schrieb:

hey shahrukh, how are the KEFs coming along... In what areas are they different from the DImaonds u had? I guess u had the same equipment / room for both.. DOes the Uni-Q arrangement have a conspicous effect on sound reproduction? Do Let us all know!!! Nimz

They're actually coming along quite well, thank you. Initially they did worry me but now that they've broken in they sound gooood. They're not as warm as the Wharfies but yes, they're more transparent. Instrument seaparation is better, low end is good, hi freqs are good. Honestly speaking I had fallen in love with the Diamond's midrange, so this area in the KEF will still take some time getting used to.

That said, as an overall package I'd rate these KEFs higher. Very musical and quite exciting (after that nerve-wracking break-in period). For those who say break-in is a myth, please listen to the KEF iQ5s straight out of the box.

As far as the UniQ goes, all I can say is the image doesn't go totally haywire with different placements. I've experimented about 7 times with toe-in and placements. Each time with different results but that centre image stayed put. Yes it was thin, low in height at times, but it stayed bang in the centre.

square_wave schrieb:

Sorry. Tried everything but it still does not cure the cabinet resonance due to very cheap cabinet build as it is a 20k commercial speaker. The cabinet resonance affects the quality of the bass too which was irritating to say the least. You fail to understand the difference between room resonances and cabinet resonance and the fact that most speakers must work within an existing space or one that has been designed with things other than acoustics in mind.

hey man..do your preaching elsewhere.....
i know what i am speaking of...am not misunderstnading anything...i know more about speakers than u wioll ever know...i no longer have the proclivity to reply to ignoramuses like u..

Dear Square Wave
The simplest way to rid the cabinet of spurious resonances is a simple trick.Most budget speakers are braced front to back and side to side(a figure of8).Such speakers are rarely braced top to bottom, as production techniques of flat packs do not allow such a luxury of time andthe effort of CNC cutting in both dimensions forhorizontal and vertical braces.A cross section of a B&W Nautilus will show the complexity involved.The simple solution is, take a slab of 1" thick mild steel plate, and put it on the top of the speaker, as it is usually the top baffle that colours the sound.Put a piece of felt between the speaker top and the steel plate so as to properly dampen all resonances including the ones being created when two hard surfaces touch each other.This type of mass loading will also silence the sides of the enclosures to an extent.
Regards Deaf

Mass loading helps but still cabinet bracing would do a better job IMHO.

and be sure to get a good paint job or the metal slab anodized or power coated..good powder coating is hard to come by in Bangalore...
personally i would go with a slab of highly polished granite..something which i have unlimited access to.

Deaf agree with you on the bracing thing..
it really is a chore..
putting two simple horizontal ones itself was quite a job...and without CNC..doing H braces would be really really difficult..

Savyasaachi schrieb:

Mass loading helps but still cabinet bracing would do a better job IMHO. and be sure to get a good paint job or the metal slab anodized or power coated..good powder coating is hard to come by in Bangalore...

Sure, but this is a trick to get best out of a manufactured budget box.If I had my way I would not use a wooden box at all.Man the feeling of a unboxed speaker is some thing else,but that deserves another thresd though.
Regards Deaf

Agree completely..
after looking and ging thru the details of all the dipole open baffel speakers on diyaudio.com....wow1..those guys have some serious talnet.not to mentoin access to specialised equipment(which in IMHO is the most crucial thing and Expensive)..

The thought of having my own push push dipole open baffles just blows my mind every tie i think about it...that would be something really special..

Savyasaachi schrieb:

Agree completely.. after looking and ging thru the details of all the dipole open baffel speakers on diyaudio.com....wow1..those guys have some serious talnet.not to mentoin access to specialised equipment(which in IMHO is the most crucial thing and Expensive).. The thought of having my own push push dipole open baffles just blows my mind every tie i think about it...that would be something really special..

It is not as difficult as it seems to get an open baffle going though.The trick is quite simple, the only constraint is size about 20" wide and a minimum of 3.5' behind the speaker.Two reasons for my mom to throw me out of the house.Anyways since space is a constraint I went about doing other things and have gotten pretty good results.Start a new thread for this man.
Regards Deaf

heheh..taht's same reason why i did not go this route..

though i wl once i have my own pad..

and from what i read....placement is extremely crucial for such speakers...ur right this deserves a whole new thread by itself..

Savyasaachi schrieb:

square_wave schrieb: Sorry. Tried everything but it still does not cure the cabinet resonance due to very cheap cabinet build as it is a 20k commercial speaker. The cabinet resonance affects the quality of the bass too which was irritating to say the least. You fail to understand the difference between room resonances and cabinet resonance and the fact that most speakers must work within an existing space or one that has been designed with things other than acoustics in mind. hey man..do your preaching elsewhere..... i know what i am speaking of...am not misunderstnading anything...i know more about speakers than u wioll ever know...i no longer have the proclivity to reply to ignoramuses like u..

Here he goes again without understanding what I was trying to say…………………
Try and understand the thread and reasons behind different comments before you go around teaching others the art and science of speaker design There is a context behind the suggestions. What is your problem ? If want to teach us the intricacies of cabinet design, do start a separate thread on it as deaf suggested and stop wasting others time.
Just because you read some books or participated on diyaudio sites and put together one speaker does not make you a great speaker designer. I have talked to people who have spend decades perfecting the art of loudspeaker design and believe me, they are humble and down to earth. They are humbled by the fact there is so much to learn even though they have been doing this for decades. If I have some doubts I shall talk to them rather than an upstart-newbie like you. Dude, I have nothing against you personally. It is your attitude and “out of context “ comments on this site that irks me.

square_wave schrieb:

Here he goes again without understanding what I was trying to say………………… Try and understand the thread and reasons behind different comments before you go around teaching others the art and science of speaker design There is a context behind the suggestions. What is your problem ? If want to teach us the intricacies of cabinet design, do start a separate thread on it as deaf suggested and stop wasting others time. Just because you read some books or participated on diyaudio sites and put together one speaker does not make you a great speaker designer. I have talked to people who have spend decades perfecting the art of loudspeaker design and believe me, they are humble and down to earth. They are humbled by the fact there is so much to learn even though they have been doing this for decades. If I have some doubts I shall talk to them rather than an upstart-newbie like you. Dude, I have nothing against you personally. It is your attitude and “out of context “ comments on this site that irks me.

here u go again ...all u know is say taht u spent time with that audsiophile and this audiophiel..
u seem to excel at whta most lameass indians are at...talk ..talk and talk some more...and all talk is BS...peddling wares to get on the good side of distributors and dealers so u can go listen to some high end systems...u are a classic sychophant...have some respect for urself and stop being servile..


Yeah i did read some books..at lesat i took the initiative..eyah i took part in online discussions...met a lot of nice people....who are u to judge what i gained from those activities...

build something and u will know how much u can learnm...the effort that goes into it...
what the hell do u know abt it..
i don't need to justify what i know or what i can do or what i can build..
i get nothing in return...i like to have a conversation with someone who knows more tahn me..taht way i am sure i learn something by the end of the conversation..

People who want to learn about something will take the initaive to do so...i don't need to do anything..
its not a charity am running..

Savyasaachi schrieb:

square_wave schrieb: Here he goes again without understanding what I was trying to say………………… Try and understand the thread and reasons behind different comments before you go around teaching others the art and science of speaker design There is a context behind the suggestions. What is your problem ? If want to teach us the intricacies of cabinet design, do start a separate thread on it as deaf suggested and stop wasting others time. Just because you read some books or participated on diyaudio sites and put together one speaker does not make you a great speaker designer. I have talked to people who have spend decades perfecting the art of loudspeaker design and believe me, they are humble and down to earth. They are humbled by the fact there is so much to learn even though they have been doing this for decades. If I have some doubts I shall talk to them rather than an upstart-newbie like you. Dude, I have nothing against you personally. It is your attitude and “out of context “ comments on this site that irks me. here u go again ...all u know is say taht u spent time with that audsiophile and this audiophiel.. u seem to excel at whta most lameass indians are at...talk ..talk and talk some more...and all talk is BS...peddling wares to get on the good side of distributors and dealers so u can go listen to some high end systems...u are a classic sychophant...have some respect for urself and stop being servile.. Yeah i did read some books..at lesat i took the initiative..eyah i took part in online discussions...met a lot of nice people....who are u to judge what i gained from those activities... build something and u will know how much u can learnm...the effort that goes into it... what the hell do u know abt it.. i don't need to justify what i know or what i can do or what i can build.. i get nothing in return...i like to have a conversation with someone who knows more tahn me..taht way i am sure i learn something by the end of the conversation.. People who want to learn about something will take the initaive to do so...i don't need to do anything.. its not a charity am running..

What an attitude ! I guess you must be a guy with some super powers because you seem to assume a lot of things about me without even having met me even once………I do not want to turn this into a circus because I know quite a bunch of esteemed and respected members of this forum personally so I refrain from giving you a fitting reply.
I hope you learn how to be humble some day. I have been where you are some 10 years ago so I understand your problem. Any way I guess I have better things to do than to argue with a lad like you. Have a good day.

there u go again..preaching things ...things u don't even follow..and who says i got a problem...

I hope you learn how to be humble some day.

and don't u try to come off as a well wisher ...can anyone be more hypocritic ...people like u make me wanna

hey guys.. why dont you PM each other and sort this out

nothing to sort out arj..this my last post on the thread...

hey Benks where are you???in Mysore or Massachusetts...your phone is so damn not reachable???? anyway good to see you active...any upgrades on your project?? Work's so hectic that I hardly get spare time..so I think it's only dreaming about projects for time being...anybody help me ...aaaaaaaarrrghhhhhhhhhhhhhh

hey guys.. why dont you PM each other and sort this out

Arj you have assumed role of a peace moderator here.. .good if you interrupt more often between members and avoid flare up's..

Folks I have seen on other forums that mallu's don't give up with each other no matter what happens, so I guess it's the same case here.

Sorry guys. I know you guys must be pissed of with this mundane pissing contest. Shall try and ignore irrelevant posts from now on. Sorry once more……….

Sorry guys. I know you guys must be pissed of with this mundane pissing contest. Shall try and ignore irrelevant posts from now on. Sorry once more……….

hey Vinny whats a discussion without some spice and whats a forum without members contradiciting each other..I assume that when some one confronts us we give our best..

I know Mohan but sometimes if you think about it, I feel it is not worth it. After all we are all in this for music and whatever advice we give although limited by our current knowledge are given in the best interest of the person involved and based on our own experiences. Arguments are best avoided if it is not positive as it leaves unpleasant memories and prejudices about the person you argued with and turns into a circus for others.

and turns into a circus for others.

very true and we look like jokers...

SUB_BOSS schrieb:

and turns into a circus for others. very true and we look like jokers...

Fully Agree.....

SUB_BOSS schrieb:

hey Benks where are you???in Mysore or Massachusetts...your phone is so damn not reachable???? anyway good to see you active...any upgrades on your project?? Work's so hectic that I hardly get spare time..so I think it's only dreaming about projects for time being...anybody help me ...aaaaaaaarrrghhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Hey Mohan..
hmm..i don't know man..my cell is active..never turn the damn thing off..
am still in Mysore buddy..gonna be coming home this weekend..
actually i was supposed to fix my amplifier last week itself..but i ran into some problems after final assembly..there seems to be a short in one of the modules..and i did not want to try turning it on lest i blow anotehr amp..
hence am hoping to solve it this weekend and get my system back in action..
Btw,have started off on a new project too..a pretty hot one...will talk to u abt it sometime..



btw, regarding ur project...hmm..well i suggest u start with the wiki pages in diyaudio.com..
lots of info on horns..i looked thru them and decided to stay away from them for the time being....thought i might as well learn some more abt the conventional speakers..
have been out of touch with audio for close to 2 months..

this place is good except that they have way too many rules over here..pity that they won't allow us to bring audio systems into the campus...we smuggle USB players in...has been sustaining me for now...

the link never used to work in the campus..just tried it yesterday night for the heck of it and hello....

Cheers,
Benkenobi

Savyasaachi schrieb:

this place is good except that they have way too many rules over here..pity that they won't allow us to bring audio systems into the campus...we smuggle USB players in...has been sustaining me for now...

Goodness , No Audio systems ?

Priory of Sion Perchance ?