Help me . .find replacement - upgrade for Wadi 581i

bhagwan69 schrieb:

Basically, if the HDD is done in a 'particular' manner & the SSD's are installed, I do believe that the performance will surely improve. That is the next step to do. Change the HDD's to SSD's [cost is a major issue] ! :(

Thats the conclusion I have arrived at as well. Wait for SSDs to get cheaper then use a Good desktop config with SSD + USB Dac ( And that is where the problems begin)

the problem with Firewire is that the quality of Firewire controllers vary a lot and that can have an impact on the resultant quality. hence USB especially with the mouthwatering prospect of USB3 speeds is a great prospect

BTW is there any Desktop config whch has an external PSU possibility ?

sivat schrieb:

It could be my mistake in understanding what you had mentioned earlier....but i have PMed you the name..

That EMC-1 was not mine;
The one that I had was sold in Mumbai & a fellow audiophile friend - sacd7 [forum member] - has it.
My player had a serial number - 1334 - just so that the one in Bangalore can be differentiated.

Amp_Nut schrieb:

Siva, the replacement that you did, was probably MANY moons ago ( or a rather old model... probably a pre 2001 model, though you would have repaired it MUCH later)! That (pre 2001 model) was when the player was NOT 24/192 Upsampling ... I suspect. Yes, now it IS a Philips Pro Mech. Incidentally, the Transport replacement from EC for this CD player is priced at approx Euros 1,100. Regards

This Link was posted sometime back.. gives the list of most transport mechanisms by brand of CDP/transport

Just one more thing....CRC does not resolve issues in time domain.

Amp_Nut,

A friend forwared me a review of hifi-world on EMC-1 UP.

It had a photo of the transport portion....the module is infact CD-Pro2LF. This module is very easy to identify.

It was not apparent from the EC website itself...

Regards
Siva.

msb1 schrieb:

Hi, I was considering using a Mac Mini as I was looking at a firewire DAC and also like the capability of using my Ipod to control the library.

The New mac Mini just launched is Awesome.

http://www.apple.com/macmini/features.html
http://images.apple....diagram_20100615.jpg

Just wish there were a good alternative to iTunes ...
a firewire based HDD for Music and a Good USB Dac OR USb to Spdif and its Game on.

[quote="bhagwan69"]

Basically, if the HDD is done in a 'particular' manner & the SSD's are installed, I do believe that the performance will surely improve. That is the next step to do. Change the HDD's to SSD's [cost is a major issue] ! [/quote]
[/quote]

I've configured Foobar to buffer the entire length of the track into RAM. This minimized HDD reads. Try it.

Here's a link on PC tweaks from the Empirical Audio forum:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=37387.0

With regards to the MAC Mini, I dont see the advantage of it for Computer Audio anymore. Foobar controlled by an Ipod works/sounds as good, if not better than Amarra on a MAC.

USB to SPDIF apparently is not the right way to go. Some even consider this as flawed. The right way is USB to I2S to DAC. However, I2S does not travel well, hence the USB to I2S to DAC should be implemented in one box.

msb1 schrieb:

USB to SPDIF apparently is not the right way to go. Some even consider this as flawed. The right way is USB to I2S to DAC. However, I2S does not travel well, hence the USB to I2S to DAC should be implemented in one box.

does this mean that your HDD output travels on a USB cable to a box that implements the I2S-to-DAC?
if yes, then, this is flawed again because the digital has to travel on a USB cable implying that you need 2 kick-ass USB transceiver components - one in the computer & one in the I2S-->DAC box - so that jitter during the USB transmission is very low (there supposedly zero jitter reading the music file off the HDD).
So, aren't we back to square-1 - you buy a kick-ass computer system & associated software for SOTA computer sound & ruin everything by using a USB cable to transmit the music to the IS2-to-DAC box??
Or, am I being too dumb & missing some/the point here??

bombaywalla schrieb:

does this mean that your HDD output travels on a USB cable to a box that implements the I2S-to-DAC? if yes, then, this is flawed again because the digital has to travel on a USB cable implying that you need 2 kick-ass USB transceiver components - one in the computer & one in the I2S-->DAC box - so that jitter during the USB transmission is very low (there supposedly zero jitter reading the music file off the HDD). So, aren't we back to square-1 - you buy a kick-ass computer system & associated software for SOTA computer sound & ruin everything by using a USB cable to transmit the music to the IS2-to-DAC box?? Or, am I being too dumb & missing some/the point here?? :(

What I am saying is it's better to go USB straight to a DAC that implements USB to I2S to DAC in one box rather than USB to SPDIF and then to a DAC. That's all.

IMO that is the currently the 'better' way to do it of the 2. All this may change very soon since digital playback is in a nascent stage and rapidly developing. I think HDMI is a better interface but dont know off any 'audiophile' grade HDMI DAC's.

Msb, just y'day I was going thru the hdmi specs and was thinking the same thing ! Hdmi output from source/computer into hdmi input into dac/processor

Maybe those high end dedicated ht processors do hdmi audio for digital output ?

Manek

PS audio's Perfect wave transport and dac are coupled via HDMI using I2S. but they made it a proprietary format and a regular HDMI cannot be used..

Manek schrieb:

Msb, just y'day I was going thru the hdmi specs and was thinking the same thing ! Hdmi output from source/computer into hdmi input into dac/processor Maybe those high end dedicated ht processors do hdmi audio for digital output ? Manek

Hi, Yes receivers that accept HDMI would have a DA for the audio. Dont know how good it is. But with the bandwidth that HDMI can carry, it would be logical to use it for audio. Just a matter of time. There is USB 3.0 also to consider.

IMHO, the main reason HDMI is being explored as a )non-standard) interface for DACs is that it can be used as an I2S connector,

Besides the high bandwidth requirement for the I2S interface (to preserve the sharp transitions of the Clock's square wave rising and falling edges) ....


I2S requires a 4 wire data path.

The USB 1 & 2 offer only 2 wires ( @ for data and 2 for the Power Supply)

The SPDIF offers only 2 wires.

The HDMI has 19 Wires !

( Of which 1 is for the Power Supply) the Ground is thru the outer metal rim of the HDMI connector.)

Arj said :

The New mac Mini just launched is Awesome. http://www.apple.com/macmini/features.html http://images.apple....diagram_20100615.jpg Just wish there were a good alternative to iTunes ... a firewire based HDD for Music and a Good USB Dac OR USb to Spdif and its Game on.

Hi Arj, about the same time as your post, Bryston announced their : BDP-1 High Resolution Digital Music Player

This gizmo Does NOT contain a DAC. An external DAC is required.

From what I understand ( Please correct me if I am wrong ) that this US $2.1 K device is a LINUX computer ( with built in sound card for basic audio monitoring / fault finding) that substitutes the Win Computer + Foobar or MAC + Itunes / AMAARA.

I think I have not fully understood this device ...



There is No Keyboard to enter the song artist that you want to locate.

The 1 line display on the unit cannot display album art or all songs on a CD, at a single glance.

I guess I am missing something ( a LOT ).

Can someone please throw some more light on this unit ??/

AN.. this has flummoxed me as well

The Bryston BDP-1’s sole function is to give music aficionados the ability to enjoy their library of high-resolution digital music files (resolutions of up to 24-bit/192kHz are supported) residing on a USB storage device, which in turn is directly connected via standard USB cable or thumb drive to the BDP-1 digital music player...... “The Bryston BDP-1 does not contain an internal DAC, a hard-drive, a streamer, a CD player/ripper, noisy fans or switching power supplies. The BDP-1 connects to an external DAC for playback through AES-EBU or BNC digital outputs. Quite simply, the BDP-1 is an ultra high-performance digital music player when connected to an external drive and DAC,” said Tanner.

.
As you say this just seems to be a slim computer running linux and converting to SPDIF with no external displaye

for 1/3rd of USD2100. one can get a mac Mini and run nativeLinux on that with all firewire/usb/display driver and Run Foobar on that....

...and add a Weiss INT202 firewire to SPDIF converter for USD1300 giving Far better sound

Uh.. the GUI needs to be done thru a different device

Explaining the BDP-1, Bryston's James tanner stated, "The BDP-1 is a technically sophisticated component incorporating state-of-the-art solid-state electronics that link up to your home network and may be controlled by a variety of graphic interface devices (e.g., laptop, Netbook, PC, PDA, iPhone, web browser, etc.). The BDP-1’s graphic interface operates under 'open source' software protocols, ensuring long-term future proofing and compatibility with the widest possible range of other digital devices as they are developed. We will also be developing our own Bryston web-based MPD client. The main point to understand here is the BDP-1 is accessing the digital files from the attached USB drives(s) directly and not streaming files on the network. The network is only used to interface your library storage on your remote (iTouch, laptop, notebook, etc.) or using a web browser on your computer as the interface. This approach eliminates all the issues inherent in streaming high-resolution digital files over the home network."

Hi all,
This thread has become a intersting one for digital streaming, I came across this while looking at the new transport being used by wadia.

http://www.streamunlimited.com/v2/index.php?show=s700

Hi Ani,

VERY interesting product, with the HUGE bonus that it will do DIGITAL out from the iPod, just like the (expensive) Wadia Dock.

I checked out the demo video on the product ... the user interface is fairly primative and needs a LOT of"Drilling Down" to get to a particular song, with no search feature .. I guess they want the OEM to value add with a more search friendly interface and software...

This is a streaming solution, while Bryston's is a non-streaming ( ? ) solution ?

Can someone please explain the difference and the pros and cons of streaming vs non streaming, for this application ?

Anil, thats a really good find..wonder if that is an option for DIY folks as well.

AN, this streaming part is confusing , does it mean
-the analogue signal going on the TCP/IP layer to some receiver which can decoded back the original analogue signal ?
OR

-the TCP/IP transmission of the digital (SPDIF) signal which is captured and then converted to an Analogue by a DAC ?

I would assume it is the former..but is that good ?

Arj, My knowledge of IP is rudimentary and I had to read your post 3 times before I got a handle on it.

The DAC is not part of the solution by streamunlimited.

Hence I think, they are working completely in the digital domain, and there is No Analogue streaming ...

Internet radio is a streaming application, and that if probably why they have worked on a streaming solution... ?

Amp_Nut schrieb:

The DAC is not part of the solution by streamunlimited.

Thats right

so now it wold be interesting how this has been implemented... as if it the SPDIF is being made into tcpip packets and being streamed you need a receiving equiment to handle this and put it back into the standard SPDIF form to be decoded...

actualy i would prefer that the compute file be broken up into the TCPIP layer. it be decoded back and then converted into SPDIF for the DAC.

Now the question is if this is going to transmit streaming media OR provide playback for intgernet straming devices

maybe it is the latter ?

all that intellecual talk by me.. says so in the First line

The Stream700 is a versatile UPnP/DLNA 1.5 streaming client and Internet Audio Platform....

So it is the streaming client and not the server....it just plays all the strreaming radios of the web.

Arj... I am lost ... a lot of this

UPnP/DLNA 1.5 streaming client

is Complete Greek to me !

Can you please 'translate' ...

Arj schrieb:

AN.. this has flummoxed me as well The Bryston BDP-1’s sole function is to give music aficionados the ability to enjoy their library of high-resolution digital music files (resolutions of up to 24-bit/192kHz are supported) residing on a USB storage device, which in turn is directly connected via standard USB cable or thumb drive to the BDP-1 digital music player...... “The Bryston BDP-1 does not contain an internal DAC, a hard-drive, a streamer, a CD player/ripper, noisy fans or switching power supplies. The BDP-1 connects to an external DAC for playback through AES-EBU or BNC digital outputs. Quite simply, the BDP-1 is an ultra high-performance digital music player when connected to an external drive and DAC,” said Tanner. . As you say this just seems to be a slim computer running linux and converting to SPDIF with no external displaye for 1/3rd of USD2100. one can get a mac Mini and run nativeLinux on that with all firewire/usb/display driver and Run Foobar on that.... ...and add a Weiss INT202 firewire to SPDIF converter for USD1300 giving Far better sound

To me it seems that the BDP-1 is focussing on reducing any power supply related noise that gets introduced in a normal Computer which has an SMPS with fans running. I suppose they would also be trying to minimize/eliminate any component that isnt really required for the purpose of SPDIF conversion but is present in a conventional Laptop/PC, thus optimizing everything for the sake of giving out a high quality SPDIF. You use a Laptop only as GUI hence no negative effect on the actual music file processing.

How good is it compared to Weiss is something we have to see. But does Weiss accept USB ?

Amp_Nut schrieb:

Arj... I am lost ... a lot of this UPnP/DLNA 1.5 streaming client is Complete Greek to me ! Can you please 'translate' ... :hail

not a techie but have come across this..so
UPnP: Unoversal plug 'n play .Protocol primarily used for gaming peripherals to find out each other on the net..works in the internet layer (Http ...).

DLNA: Digital Living some network Association (?) or...:standards used for managing media content

abhi.pani schrieb:

How good is it compared to Weiss is something we have to see. But does Weiss accept USB ?

Weiss is only Firewire..they are going down that path.
On the USB side Empitrical audio is perhaps the best one I have heard about till now from a pure conversion to SPDIF

WAVELENGTH AUDIO is another stalwart with USB DACs.

Infact wavelength Audio has licenced its solution to Ayre.

Unfortunately to me, Wavelenght Audio DACs look (to me!) like they have been designed by an Orangutan with a screw driver

Ditto for Scott-Nixon.com DACs.. Atleast The Scott-Nixon DACs are (relatively) reasonably priced

YMMV

Hi AN, problem with both Wavelength and Ayre is that they are DACS. so if you already have a good dac you may just want a SPDIF converter...

Arj,

Wouldnt it be better to have the USB-SPIDF conversion done within the DAC ?

My thinking is that if this convertor is run of the same clock as that of DAC or in sync wouldnt it help ?

Ani, that is true.. and from what i understand it would be an Internal USB to I2S which is better for very short distances.

problem is for folks who already have a pr3eference for a DAC..you lose that flexibility

O.... or better still USB to I2S directly inside the USB DAC unit.. No need for a flawed, 2 wire SPDIF interface.

msb1 schrieb:

bombaywalla schrieb: does this mean that your HDD output travels on a USB cable to a box that implements the I2S-to-DAC? if yes, then, this is flawed again because the digital has to travel on a USB cable implying that you need 2 kick-ass USB transceiver components - one in the computer & one in the I2S-->DAC box - so that jitter during the USB transmission is very low (there supposedly zero jitter reading the music file off the HDD). So, aren't we back to square-1 - you buy a kick-ass computer system & associated software for SOTA computer sound & ruin everything by using a USB cable to transmit the music to the IS2-to-DAC box?? Or, am I being too dumb & missing some/the point here?? :( What I am saying is it's better to go USB straight to a DAC that implements USB to I2S to DAC in one box rather than USB to SPDIF and then to a DAC. That's all. IMO that is the currently the 'better' way to do it of the 2. All this may change very soon since digital playback is in a nascent stage and rapidly developing. I think HDMI is a better interface but dont know off any 'audiophile' grade HDMI DAC's.

ani schrieb:

Arj, Wouldnt it be better to have the USB-SPIDF conversion done within the DAC ? My thinking is that if this convertor is run of the same clock as that of DAC or in sync wouldnt it help ?

Amp_Nut schrieb:

O.... or better still USB to I2S directly inside the USB DAC unit.. No need for a flawed, 2 wire SPDIF interface.

gosh, all you guys are just chattering WITHOUT listening!!
This is EXACTLY what MSB1 was recommending - see his post in my above quotation. You guys have have chattered, gone full circle & landed up exactly at MSB1's recommendation!!
Don't you guys read others' post before you write your own???

OK, now that all of you are with the program - please read my underlined post above re. the USB transmission being a potentially flawed method to transmit the music just due to the nature of how USB transceiver ICs are made.
(MSB1 & Arj were pondering whether there are any audiophile HDMI DACs to circumvent the flawed USB transmission format). So, I ask again:

does this mean that your HDD output travels on a USB cable to a box that implements the I2S-to-DAC?
if yes, then, this is flawed again because the digital has to travel on a USB cable implying that you need 2 kick-ass USB transceiver components - one in the computer & one in the I2S-->DAC box - so that jitter during the USB transmission is very low
Does anyone know of a really very good USB transceiver IC chipset that implements very low jitter transmission??
The only chipset that I know of is the one used in the Wavelength DAC (orangutan with screwdriver manufacturer LOL!) & the very same one used in the Ayre QB1 DAC.

bombaywalla schrieb:

Don't you guys read others' post before you write your own???

Naah..no fun in that

kidding aside,

bombaywalla schrieb:

Does anyone know of a really very good USB transceiver IC chipset that implements very low jitter transmission??

this is one question which is really confusing..I am not even sure if USB is the best medium since USB eats up processor time and the more the number of USB devices you have (Including Mouse and Keyboard) chances of jitter are anyway high.

That way Firewire is better but is seems to be on the way to a decline....and needs some really good programming to make it jittter proof...which Weiss seem to have done.
BTW is TCPIP a good way for digital transmission ? was imagining a TCPIP DAC..it has built in clock in the format and speeds upto 100mbps...

Hi Bombaywalla,

You have hit the nail right on the head no one reads others post That is why this thread turned into discussion on usb, I2s etc !!

But it is interesting to read what info others have gathered.
Regards
Anil

bombaywalla schrieb:

So, I ask again: does this mean that your HDD output travels on a USB cable to a box that implements the I2S-to-DAC? if yes, then, this is flawed again because the digital has to travel on a USB cable implying that you need 2 kick-ass USB transceiver components - one in the computer & one in the I2S-->DAC box - so that jitter during the USB transmission is very low

just reread and found your question again (D'Uh it was underlined )

I dont think USB transfer can have jitter as Jitter byt itself means timing error due to timing/clock and USB data does not have a clock until it is added during an SPDIF OR I2S conversion. But I would not be surprised if we do have data loss due to not so good USB implementation

Arj schrieb:

bombaywalla schrieb: So, I ask again: does this mean that your HDD output travels on a USB cable to a box that implements the I2S-to-DAC? if yes, then, this is flawed again because the digital has to travel on a USB cable implying that you need 2 kick-ass USB transceiver components - one in the computer & one in the I2S-->DAC box - so that jitter during the USB transmission is very low just reread and found your question again (D'Uh it was underlined )

bad boy! not reading the posts before writing your own. LOL!

Arj schrieb:

I dont think USB transfer can have jitter as Jitter byt itself means timing error due to timing/clock and USB data does not have a clock until it is added during an SPDIF OR I2S conversion. But I would not be surprised if we do have data loss due to not so good USB implementation

naaah! even tho' USB protocol does not have an explicit clock, the scheme uses NRZI (non return to zero, inverted) format for data xmission wherein the clock is embedded. The USB receiver has to do a clock recovery before pulling out the data. All USB transmissions are controlled by the host & there is some variation allowed in when the transmission packet can commence. I believe that the transmission packets are 1mS in duration but the next 1mS packet does not always start exactly after the prev one finishes. So, this variability does introduce jitter & does seem to ruin the audio. My limited understanding of the USB protocol.....

bombaywalla said:

gosh, all you guys are just chattering WITHOUT listening!! This is EXACTLY what MSB1 was recommending - see his post in my above quotation. You guys have have chattered, gone full circle & landed up exactly at MSB1's recommendation!! Don't you guys read others' post before you write your own???

I don't post ONLY when I dis-agree. ( That in my books would be a BAD Boy ! )

I also post when I AGREE with what someone has said... especially at some other point in the thread ( That in my books is NOT Being a Bad Boy, or "chattering WITHOUT listening!!" ).

In this case, I Obviously Agreed with what MSB1 said and was re-affirming his statement.

Anyway whats the fun in a forum where every post looks like a technical paper with reference to other posts

this is a forum...not a wiki..

Has anyone tried out the Red Wine Audio Isabellina daci with an USB option ?
it comes in with its own battery based power and is based on USB->I2s into the dac interinsically.

If ARN systems have it this would be a very good place to start..altough it supports only upto 48Khz in USB (Not sure if the USB is asynchronous )

bombaywalla schrieb:

naaah! even tho' USB protocol does not have an explicit clock, the scheme uses NRZI (non return to zero, inverted) format for data xmission wherein the clock is embedded. The USB receiver has to do a clock recovery before pulling out the data. All USB transmissions are controlled by the host & there is some variation allowed in when the transmission packet can commence. I believe that the transmission packets are 1mS in duration but the next 1mS packet does not always start exactly after the prev one finishes. So, this variability does introduce jitter & does seem to ruin the audio. My limited understanding of the USB protocol.....

My Techie roots are dead, buried and pertified rock now, But isnt Async USB supposed to take care of that ? the ones Wavelength andEmpirical have developed

Amp_Nut schrieb:

bombaywalla said: gosh, all you guys are just chattering WITHOUT listening!! This is EXACTLY what MSB1 was recommending - see his post in my above quotation. You guys have have chattered, gone full circle & landed up exactly at MSB1's recommendation!! Don't you guys read others' post before you write your own??? I don't post ONLY when I dis-agree. ( That in my books would be a BAD Boy ! )

heh, heh, heh!! Point taken Amp_Nut.
ANyway, it's more fun & far more enlightening to me (& maybe to other members as well) when a discussion is started due to disagreement of opinion. Lots of technical & subjective & (sometimes even objective - it's audio! ) details come out that enlighten me. That's what I'm after personally - what is the real reason to do one thing over another.
If I agree w/ some then all I have to say is 1 word - "Amen". It makes for very little advancement of knowledge.
Again, just my opinion.

Amp_Nut schrieb:

I also post when I AGREE with what someone has said... especially at some other point in the thread ( That in my books is NOT Being a Bad Boy, or "chattering WITHOUT listening!!" ). In this case, I Obviously Agreed with what MSB1 said and was re-affirming his statement.

OK, thanx for the clarification. Good to know that you agree w/ MSB1.

Arj schrieb:

bombaywalla schrieb: naaah! even tho' USB protocol does not have an explicit clock, the scheme uses NRZI (non return to zero, inverted) format for data xmission wherein the clock is embedded. The USB receiver has to do a clock recovery before pulling out the data. All USB transmissions are controlled by the host & there is some variation allowed in when the transmission packet can commence. I believe that the transmission packets are 1mS in duration but the next 1mS packet does not always start exactly after the prev one finishes. So, this variability does introduce jitter & does seem to ruin the audio. My limited understanding of the USB protocol..... My Techie roots are dead, buried and pertified rock now, But isnt Async USB supposed to take care of that ? the ones Wavelength andEmpirical have developed

Arj,
correct! Wavelength (J. Gordon Rankin) has developed what seems to be a powerful USB interface for audio using the TI TAS1020B USB controller that has an embedded Intel 8051 microcontroller in it. This interface is being used in the brand new Ayre QB DAC. I believe that the TI TAS1020B supports USB isochronous transmissions & using some custom code shoved into its EPROM, Wavelength can make USB transmission virtually jitter-free. The TI TAS1020B is very complex to use from my understanding.
Note also that almost nobody else is using this hi-end chipset. The others use the cheaper TI PCM27XX chipset & end up w/ much higher jitter.
So, the best USB solution in the market is very expensive (& looks hideous to some ) & not many are willing to pay for it.
But you are correct - Wavelength's figured it out & you have to pay the piper for the best solution.

bombaywalla schrieb:

Arj schrieb: bombaywalla schrieb: naaah! even tho' USB protocol does not have an explicit clock, the scheme uses NRZI (non return to zero, inverted) format for data xmission wherein the clock is embedded. The USB receiver has to do a clock recovery before pulling out the data. All USB transmissions are controlled by the host & there is some variation allowed in when the transmission packet can commence. I believe that the transmission packets are 1mS in duration but the next 1mS packet does not always start exactly after the prev one finishes. So, this variability does introduce jitter & does seem to ruin the audio. My limited understanding of the USB protocol..... My Techie roots are dead, buried and pertified rock now, But isnt Async USB supposed to take care of that ? the ones Wavelength andEmpirical have developed Arj, correct! Wavelength (J. Gordon Rankin) has developed what seems to be a powerful USB interface for audio using the TI TAS1020B USB controller that has an embedded Intel 8051 microcontroller in it. This interface is being used in the brand new Ayre QB DAC. I believe that the TI TAS1020B supports USB isochronous transmissions & using some custom code shoved into its EPROM, Wavelength can make USB transmission virtually jitter-free. The TI TAS1020B is very complex to use from my understanding. Note also that almost nobody else is using this hi-end chipset. The others use the cheaper TI PCM27XX chipset & end up w/ much higher jitter. So, the best USB solution in the market is very expensive (& looks hideous to some ) & not many are willing to pay for it. But you are correct - Wavelength's figured it out & you have to pay the piper for the best solution. :Y

FYI, dCS also uses the same Texas Instrument Usb chip on their upsamplers.

Regards
SNV

TAS1020B is limited to 24/96. It can't do 24/192 which the M2Tech Hiface which msb referred to earlier can do asynchronously.

reignofchaos schrieb:

TAS1020B is limited to 24/96. It can't do 24/192 which the M2Tech Hiface which msb referred to earlier can do asynchronously.

yes, correct, the TAS1020B is maxxed out at 24/96.
The M2Tech product looks nice. They cheaped out by providing it w/ a RCA output jack in its default configuration. After all the work they did to reduce the jitter in their hardware, write custom drivers for a plethora of MS OSs & now even for Mac, they come to the output terminal & provide a piss-poor RCA! The output impedance will be a far cry from 75 Ohms & you'll get a lot of reflected power & voila, there goes your low jitter - flushed down the toilet! You paid $150 for jack-s$$$! It should have been only BNC output, IMO.

bombaywalla schrieb:

The M2Tech product looks nice. They cheaped out by providing it w/ a RCA output jack in its default configuration.

My current implementation is:

El Cheapo USB extension cable from computer (Asus MB) to M2Tech. M2Tech is not mounted directly to USB (as intended) as I have spliced the cable to use an external battery (eBay link - diode connected in series to lower voltage to 5.2VDC) supply rather than Bus power.

M2Tech to Cary SPDIF using a Belden 89259 cable with RCAP plugs (these are known to be the closest to 75 ohm).

The Cary is being used as a DAC. I have tested tracks all the way to 24/192 and they work flawlessly through Foobar (KS out) on Win7 without any DSP, etc.

Bhagwan is visiting this weekend and we will compare this to CD. Since all else is equal we will know how good the USB-SPDIF implementation is and this should also answer your question:

does this mean that your HDD output travels on a USB cable to a box that implements the I2S-to-DAC? if yes, then, this is flawed again because the digital has to travel on a USB cable implying that you need 2 kick-ass USB transceiver components

msb1 schrieb:

bombaywalla schrieb: The M2Tech product looks nice. They cheaped out by providing it w/ a RCA output jack in its default configuration. My current implementation is: El Cheapo USB extension cable from computer (Asus MB) to M2Tech. M2Tech is not mounted directly to USB (as intended) as I have spliced the cable to use an external battery (eBay link - diode connected in series to lower voltage to 5.2VDC) supply rather than Bus power. M2Tech to Cary SPDIF using a Belden 89259 cable with RCAP plugs (these are known to be the closest to 75 ohm). The Cary is being used as a DAC. I have tested tracks all the way to 24/192 and they work flawlessly through Foobar (KS out) on Win7 without any DSP, etc. Bhagwan is visiting this weekend and we will compare this to CD. Since all else is equal we will know how good the USB-SPDIF implementation is and this should also answer your question: does this mean that your HDD output travels on a USB cable to a box that implements the I2S-to-DAC? if yes, then, this is flawed again because the digital has to travel on a USB cable implying that you need 2 kick-ass USB transceiver components

Hi MSB1,
thanx for the update.

In one way you have already answered my question - you DO have a kick-ass USB transceiver to reduce the jitter. Now, the question remains re. the ill-effects of the RCA connector. I expect the difference to be minimal as the bigger culprit (the USB transmission protocol implementation) has already been taken care off (atleast so it seems after reading M2Tech's webpage).

Neverthless, it will be very good to hear back from either yourself or Bhagwan69 re. the performance of your hookup as detailed above.

Bombaywalla,

http://dddac.de/

See this site for USB DAC kits. They make what is supposedly a very good USB to I2S/SPDIF card.

They also make Dac's with a unique tower of TDA1543 Chips. From what I've read the DAC is not "top end" but better than many commercial ones available.

Lots of information on the site.