USB to Digital converter

http://www.antec.com/usa/productDetails.php?lan=us&id=92480

This is the case I am using.

It has a physical issolation through :-

http://www.alto-extremo.com/html/exact.html

4 GB RAM - DDR - 800 [I think]

ASUS - MB - with Firewire 13944 - 6 pin - output.
No Display Card
No Sound Card
Intel Core 2 DUO - 2.66GHz - 3835a252

It is ready, but I have not used it as yet.
Will do so after 1 month. That is when my house should be ready & my music will start - hopefully.

Arj schrieb:

but why would you need more than 4GB if the pc is used only for playing ? i thought memory is required only for applications requiring it like multimedia editing etc. for a server dedicated as a Media server, shouldnt 1GB be more than enough ?

My understanding of Computers is rather poor. So excuse my posts - if they are incorrect, kindly 'suggest change' !

However, in my case, I do not have any sound card in my music server;
Nor is there a video display card.
I will only use my CPU to up-sample my Flac / Wave files to 192 KHz & then dupm them out through the fire wire 13944 - 6 pin - this shall be routed through the RAM.
Therefore, I feel that 4 GB of RAM may be needed. Actually 2 GB is enough, but just installing some 'extra' just in case. Besides, it was really 'cheap' !!

bhagwan69 schrieb:

Therefore, I feel that 4 GB of RAM may be needed. Actually 2 GB is enough, but just installing some 'extra' just in case. Besides, it was really 'cheap' !!

more RAM never hurts especially these days when it is cheap.
What perhaps may be more important is the CPU time alloted to the audio application. one way of doing it is
1. Running the OS at Minimal processes
2. When you run your application (Foobar ? ) in the task manager make it the highest priority application.

For RAM what is important is that the entire file should be in the RAM and not in the pagefile. the MAx size of a FLAC file would be around 1GB ( for the entire album at 24/192. for 16/44 it is only 60% of that). since your OS will hardly consume more than 0.5 GB, 2 GB should be more than enough.

bhagwan69 schrieb:

reignofchaos schrieb: This is more than enough to play any music I throw at it including 24/96 or 24/192 when I had my old DAC. Now with a NOS dac, all my listening is limited to 16/48 or 16/44. Did your Old DAC Lock @ 192 ? Interesting.... :.

Yup... 24/192 worked fine if I upsampled to that. It depends on the sound card's drivers. If the ASIO driver supports 24/192 output, it'll work else foobar will bail out with an error.

I've never really noticed any benefit from increasing foobar's priority. Didn't notice any effect of increasing ram either. One thing that did benefit sound quality quite a bit was disabling spread spectrum in the bios.

I was reading somewhere that Firewire is more prone to Jitter than USB and hence any Firewire based audio system needs to have PLL circuit to "bust" Jitter.

if this is the case , isnt it better to have a USB system ? USB3 is already out and that is so much faster..

Though firewire in theory is better, there aren't too many low jitter chips around for cheap unlike USB which has the ubiquitous Burr Brown 27xx/29xx.

An anti jitter device like the monarchy DIP might help in computer transports. Planning to get one soon.

I was reading up on the Weiss Minerva. apaprenly they too mention that Firewire is more jitterprone hence have a PLL device.

I have the Monarchy DIP which I use along with a trends USB to SPDIF converter (Battery powered).
its good

Anyone tried the newest crop of USB to SPDIF converters emanating from the dragon's lair?
Namely the Tera-Link X, Musiland USD-1 and M2Tech Hiface?

All are supposed to be asyn USB and the musiland and M2tech capacble of 24/192 while the terra link is restricted to redbook.

I have ordered the M2Tech Hiface USB to SPDIF converter. Will post once I receive it.

Lots of people have reported good things about it and that it does output 24/192 on SPDIF.

msb1 schrieb:

I have ordered the M2Tech Hiface USB to SPDIF converter. Will post once I receive it. Lots of people have reported good things about it and that it does output 24/192 on SPDIF.

I'm waiting for mine to ship as well. Seems like its the lowest jitter USB->SPDIF converter available right now.

Any Idea if this is Synchronous or Asynchronous ?

Arj schrieb:

Any Idea if this is Synchronous or Asynchronous ?

Its async and uses the Xilinx chip with custom drivers. An easy way of figuring out if a converter is async is to look at the max supported sampling rates - any BB 27xx based solution would allow a max of 16/48.

cool. nice to have cheaper alternative to the Empirical audio device ! thats really overpriced.

where are you Buying it from ?

Arj schrieb:

cool. nice to have cheaper alternative to the Empirical audio device ! thats really overpriced. where are you Buying it from ?

Direct from the maker

http://www.m2tech.biz/products.html

They have the e-mail address somewhere. The price is 99 euro + shipping (10 euro by normal post, 40 by UPS). Surprisingly its built in Italy not in China :-).

Nice. best part is no need for an USB cable as it is coupled direct. what would be interesting is the quality of the clock inside.

do post results once you get it. if required we can do a 1:1 comparison with a trends audio UD10 I have as well a the M Audio transit which is a Firewire device.

Look forward to yor impressions on the M2Tech Soum..less than satisfied with the Musiland.

Shall keep you folks posted when I receive it. I've compared the UD-10 in battery mode to my current EMU 1212M and the latter beats it inspite of being a PCI card. Had an M-Audio Audiophile before and that one was disgustingly bad.

I'm expecting the HiFace to beat the EMU convincingly going by reports as it seems to beat the LynxTWO as well in raw jitter figures.

Are you getting the BNC or RCA version?

Savyasaachi schrieb:

Are you getting the BNC or RCA version?

RCA version my DAC has an RCA input and nothing else.

reignofchaos schrieb:

Savyasaachi schrieb: Are you getting the BNC or RCA version? RCA version my DAC has an RCA input and nothing else.

aah..sucks..BNC is the way to go man..any chance of replacing it with a BNC jack?

Savyasaachi schrieb:

reignofchaos schrieb: Savyasaachi schrieb: Are you getting the BNC or RCA version? RCA version my DAC has an RCA input and nothing else. aah..sucks..BNC is the way to go man..any chance of replacing it with a BNC jack?

Its actually funny - my DAC actually has a Cardas BNC which PD has actually modified into an RCA jack. Trouble with BNC is that good cables are few and far in between. But yes coupling is definitely a lot better.

Trouble with BNC is that good cables are few and far in between. But yes coupling is definitely a lot better.

So True, So True.

Sadly, while a BNC can be bought in 50 Ohm and 75 Ohm impedences, RCA have no well defined characteristic impedance..

Ampnut

Correct me if I am wrong here but canare were offering a 75ohm rca plug. I thought that was a step in the right direction but have other manufacturers caught on ?

Whats your take on using bnc for analogue audio ? Just curious

manek

reign, any update on the M2Tech?

Yes, Manek. You are perfectly correct.

However, even though the Canare RCA PLUG may be 75 Ohms, the Female connector on your equipment is Not 75 Ohms or for that matter, any characteristic impedance. ( It is not a concentric connector)

On the other hand, the BNC connector is a concentric connector, for its Male and Female versions, and there is theoretically Streets ahead on the RCA.

The BNC also has a Bayonet mount lock (Quarter Twist to lock, just like our Indian Light bulbs).

Some manufacturers like Dart-Zeel also offer a propriety (50 ohm) BNC to BNC link between their Pre & Power Amp, and the impedance matched connection ( using 50 ohm coax ) permits links of several hundered meters ( I think their manual says even beyond 1 KM ! 0

On the other hand, my experience with 50 MHz to 2000 MHz RF (which I do for a living) tells me that poor imepedance matching is not a great concern in practice. I honestly doubt what practical difference it can bring to the table for 20 Hz to 20KHz....

I am pretty certain that Cables will affect the Sound Quality much more than the switch to BNC.


As reignofchaos mentioned, the widespread use of the RCA connectors in audio and All ( ? ) high end analog and digital interconnects, is probably a better reason to stay with RCAs.

Understood sir....tk u again.

Yes, I too have used bnc's in older computer networks and am familiar with their design and locking system.
That same thing got me thinking...can a bnc give superior contact than an rca on live and ground sections, which would tranlate to better sq ?
Your post is pretty clear that it won't make a diff.

One kilometer you say ? Wow ! :-)

Manek

any updates on the M2Tech at all?

I've been using the M2Tech Hiface for a couple of weeks now. Bought it from the UK dealer Purite Audio.

I am very impressed with this device. It sounds very good and I can say the output is mostly indistinguishable from my CD player. I havent used the player in over a week.

It works perfectly with all streams upto 24/192. I use my CARY CDP as a DAC and it shows the sample rate selected in the PC.

Playback software is JRiver and MediaMonkey. I couldnt stand the Foobar interface and it does not sound better than the first two. Both run ASIO to the Hiface driver.

Using a regular desktop PC with XP Pro. All unused services have been disabled. No AV. Wired ethernet to my router. Controlled through my laptop using remote desktop. Hiface is connected to the DAC using a custom made Belden 89259 cable with Canare RCAP RCA's (considered to the be closest to 75 ohms).

I was hoping to get a Weiss or an Empirical to compare but that hasnt happened yet. Quoting Steve of Empirical from another forum: "
The HiFace is an excellent product for the price. I believe that the current Off-Ramp 3 with Ultraclock using a good USB cable is slightly better." This product costs some $1500 and I doubt it's any better.

I would highly recommend this product to anyone going the PC Audio route. At the price, it's 'relatively' free!

I am finally getting mine today :D. Can dump my EMU card then.

What will you be using as yr DAC, RoC ?

What is your prefered Media Player ? ( eg Foobar, J River etc ? )

Amp_Nut schrieb:

What will you be using as yr DAC, RoC ? What is your prefered Media Player ? ( eg Foobar, J River etc ? )

I'll be connecting it to an AudioZone DAC-1. I use Foobar since I like the flexibility it offers.

ROC, what flexibility do you need?
I just couldnt use Foobar due to its interface.

msb1 schrieb:

Quoting Steve of Empirical from another forum: " The HiFace is an excellent product for the price. I believe that the current Off-Ramp 3 with Ultraclock using a good USB cable is slightly better." This product costs some $1500 and I doubt it's any better.

Steve has rather obscenely actually overpriced his product by at least 5 times from the uniqueness point of view . Am sure the Hiface would be as good.

having tried the Trends UD10, Maudio Audiophile Firewire and the Airport express rather dissapointingly am really tempted by this one.

MSB, i too have J river .but prefer Foobar. with the plugins and some tweaks in the Database search it can be really flexible.

ARJ,

Using KS/ASIO to the Hiface driver, I really cannot hear a difference between Jriver, Media Monkey and Foobar. Off the 3, Foobar has the lousiest interface and cannot tag wav files effectively.

Jriver is what I use now.

Incidentally, there is a way of using Itunes with the Foobar engine. I used that too but eventually stuck with Jriver.

Itunes with Foobar.. http://ta2020.huuryuu.com/MultiPlugin_e.html - Note.. this only works with the specified versions of foobar and itunes.

msb1 schrieb:

ARJ, Using KS/ASIO to the Hiface driver, I really cannot hear a difference between Jriver, Media Monkey and Foobar. Off the 3, Foobar has the lousiest interface and cannot tag wav files effectively. Jriver is what I use now. Incidentally, there is a way of using Itunes with the Foobar engine. I used that too but eventually stuck with Jriver. Itunes with Foobar.. http://ta2020.huuryuu.com/MultiPlugin_e.html - Note.. this only works with the specified versions of foobar and itunes.

MSB you shouldn't be creating wav files in the first place. The best way is to rip the CD as a single image instead of multiple wave files and then let foobar get the info from CDDB.

I prefer the foobar UI (with columnsUI plugin) over all else. Plus its the snappiest out of all the players and loads the quickest if you are trying to load music from a dump on the network.

There are also 2 ASIO drivers to choose from:

1) http://www.asio2ks.de/
2) http://www.asio4all.com/

I prefer the first one (I think it offers more resolution) but it does not work with 24bit and high rez files (96/192)

I agree with RoC in the way I rip my CDs, to a wav image .. single file and a small cue file. As long as you have internet access when ripping, the Cue file will have all the details of the track manes, artist etc, and internet access is not required during playback.

On the other hand, I recently gave J River a try and LOVED browsing albums thru their artwork / front covers. Really provoked me to listen to stuff I had ripped and never played. Sadly, J River will not handle Wav + Cue files....

Also, I got the nagging suspicion that Foobar was more open and transparent than J River.

Lucily, I have still not embrased HDD playback, so these things are hardly delimas for me.

Amp_Nut schrieb:

I agree with RoC in the way I rip my CDs, to a wav image .. single file and a small cue file. As long as you have internet access when ripping, the Cue file will have all the details of the track manes, artist etc, and internet access is not required during playback. On the other hand, I recently gave J River a try and LOVED browsing albums thru their artwork / front covers. Really provoked me to listen to stuff I had ripped and never played. Sadly, J River will not handle Wav + Cue files.... Also, I got the nagging suspicion that Foobar was more open and transparent than J River. Lucily, I have still not embrased HDD playback, so these things are hardly delimas for me.

You can get artwork/covers in foobar as well. There's an album art plugin that does that for me.

Yes, I know, and use viewing of album art, in a box on the bottom LHS... like iTunes.

However, what I was referring to in J River, is browsing thru my collection, using Album art Only. Then double click on the Album art and play the CD that catches my selection. I miss THAT in foobar.

Im sure its customisable, but dont know how. If you have done it, do let me know. Thanks

ROC, Did you get your Hiface?

I am now powering the Hiface with batteries rather than USB Bus. I think it's a substantial upgrade. Cleaner & quieter.

Used a USB extension cable. Cut off the Red (+5V) wire and connected the end towards the device to the battery +ive. Battery -ive goes to the Black (gnd) without cutting it off (just removed the plastic and connected). Powered by 4 x 1.2V (total 4.8V) Sanyo Eneloop rechargeables at the moment. Have ordered this to try: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260423194985

Have to go get it from a friend's place who picked it up at SG. Got too much work so I'm unable to get it until this weekend :(. I've heard that battery makes a big difference and seems like a harmless way to upgrade the sound without having to crack it open :).

With the battery mod, how does it sound compared to the Cary CD transport?

Using the Cary as a DAC, it sounds about the same to me. I still need to do some proper comparisons. Maybe in a day or two.

MSB, would you know how the DAC section of the cary is rated as ?
apparently the everyon is out of stock on M2Tech an more available only by march !

regarding ASIO i have not really used ASIOKS .

I do not have Wave files only Flacs/Ape/Apple Lossless and Wv so the tagging was not really an issue.

Arj schrieb:

MSB, would you know how the DAC section of the cary is rated as ?

What rating are you looking for? Specs are here:
http://www.caryaudio.com/products/classic/CD306SACDPro.html
It has a few upsampling modes till 768khz.

apparently the everyon is out of stock on M2Tech an more available only by march !

Check with Kieth at Purite Audio: puriteaudio@btinternet.com
It is a great product at a 'realistic' price that does what it's meant to do and does it right. Some USB-S/PDIF converters seem to be mindlessly priced. Read the various reviews and comparisons on different forums. I have not been able to directly compare it with similar products but have compared it to my CD player.

I do not have Wave files only Flacs/Ape/Apple Lossless and Wv so the tagging was not really an issue.

I just found J.River to be the best in terms of functionality and file management and did not find any difference between the 3 programs I tired using the same ASIO drivers as the ouput. Guess it's a matter of personal preference.

msb1 schrieb:

What rating are you looking for? Specs are here: http://www.caryaudio.com/products/classic/CD306SACDPro.html It has a few upsampling modes till 768khz.

My Apologies..i think I was a bit Vague with my question.

What i meant was your subjective view on the DAC section of the CDP

Arj schrieb:

What i meant was your subjective view on the DAC section of the CDP :)

I haven't compared just the DAC section to another DAC so can't say. I have compared the CD Player to others including my earlier Wadia 861 and one top end player costing more than 2x the Cary. In both cases I preferred the Cary. It is a very involving player.

MSB,

I was looking for a solution earlier for an ADC and contacted Firestone Audio

They have a new product called....

Bravo 24 Bit / 96 KHz Digital processor to go from USB to either Digital Coax or Toslink

http://www.wickeddig...virtuemart&Itemid=53

Does this suit your need ?

There is the Furutech GT40 which was launched at CES 2010 which should be available in 2 - 3 months.

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/ces_2010/preview/

This is a very good option as well...

Regards

HP

HP,

Not looking for anything at the moment. The whole PC/Digital audio thing is moving very fast. Will wait till things settle down and then decicde if I want a dedicated DAC IF I'm convinced it's better than what I'm presently using.

ROC, any update on that HIface..

I want to get one but I am skeptical as the Musiland I tried was worse than my on-board soundcard digital out.