single and ready to mingle - lyrita listening session

oh yes i also thought we could break this up into a listening session of the speakers and amp individually. ie if you have a pair of bookshelves and want to see how they do with the valve amp, we could play your bookshelves and the amp in the second half. anyone interested in doing that?

a personal request - could someone bring some interconnects/ power cords/ cables cos i need to buy later on and would be great to compare and see what sounds good. they're easy to carry hence i thought i'd ask. thanks in advance

Stevie, thanks for the invitation. Since it's a Sat, I guess it should be convenient for others too. Though valves are not for me, I'm eager to listen to Viren's emqnts. If need be, I can bring my CD player (Marantz CD17 MkIII) & few interconnects.

Tnks // Sudarshan

I am in...

me too...

can bring my Denon DCD 755AR if required...

hi guys ok here goes a review of the harmony ones and the valve integrated.

overall the system is extremely non-fatiguing. added advantage of high gaf factor the unique shape finds acceptance too. 'cute'. strange are the ways of the female mind but i'm not complaining

what the system does really well is reproduce tone. santana's guitar vs satriani's vs hendrix's. all beautifully fleshed out with that soul that i found missing in all other solid state systms i've heard. depth is lovely, imaging too. instruments have plenty of space to play in.

what i find magical is that you can track every instrument from start of track to finish. so if there's a tiny cymbal beginning the track and then a guitar roars in with the bass and vocals, i can still hear the cymbal going on firmly in its place. nothing seems overemphasised. how bad/ good is the bass, midrange treble with regard to other speakers? i wouldn't hazard a guess. but what shines through is the sheer togetherness and unity of the sound. overall the sound is soothing. extremely soothing. not to say that rock tracks put one to sleep. man i've never heard ac/dc reproduced so well.

there's a lot of stuff i'm hearing for the first time. and yes the combo reproduces ambience very well. on pink floyd's another brick in the wall, the children singing sound like they're in a classroom, not just a bunch of children singing.

if you like gut wrenching slam then this system wont do for you. if you're looking for a combo that lets you hear everything, puts it together musically, you'll be happy with this.

the flaws? treble on some albums seem to be dampened like ac/dc. not as crisp and sparkly as it ought to be. wont draw a conclusion cos i'm running it thru a discman. as for the physical construction of the speakers, they knock hollow from halfway to the bottom. viren says he hasnt damped it from middle to bottom for the bass factor. does this negatively affect sound? i really wont be able to tell unless i hear the same pair fully damped and rigid to the knock test. does it affect sound? not that i can discern. and yes they're light enough to be able to be shifted around easily so playing with placement is easier.

in conclusion a good system if you're into music and are a 'musicophile'
and there's nothing as soothing as watching the valves glow orange with all the lights off.. ahhhhh


please do get tons of your favorite cds when you guys drop in!

and yes 15 watts is loud enough for me!

thanks once again for the cables and complimentary cds viren. really made it possible for me to hit the ground running

for all you guys who will be coming over, am making a physical map to help you. will mail it to you all next week sometime. roughly its jp nagar 6th phase, 5 minutes from ranga shankar and 10 mins from shanti sagar jp nagar 1st phase. bout 30 mins from koramangala and mg road.

stevieboy schrieb:

hi guys ok here goes a review of the harmony ones and the valve integrated. overall the system is extremely non-fatiguing. added advantage of high gaf factor the unique shape finds acceptance too. 'cute'. strange are the ways of the female mind but i'm not complaining what the system does really well is reproduce tone. santana's guitar vs satriani's vs hendrix's. all beautifully fleshed out with that soul that i found missing in all other solid state systms i've heard. depth is lovely, imaging too. instruments have plenty of space to play in. what i find magical is that you can track every instrument from start of track to finish. so if there's a tiny cymbal beginning the track and then a guitar roars in with the bass and vocals, i can still hear the cymbal going on firmly in its place. nothing seems overemphasised. how bad/ good is the bass, midrange treble with regard to other speakers? i wouldn't hazard a guess. but what shines through is the sheer togetherness and unity of the sound. overall the sound is soothing. extremely soothing. not to say that rock tracks put one to sleep. man i've never heard ac/dc reproduced so well. there's a lot of stuff i'm hearing for the first time. and yes the combo reproduces ambience very well. on pink floyd's another brick in the wall, the children singing sound like they're in a classroom, not just a bunch of children singing. if you like gut wrenching slam then this system wont do for you. if you're looking for a combo that lets you hear everything, puts it together musically, you'll be happy with this. the flaws? treble on some albums seem to be dampened like ac/dc. not as crisp and sparkly as it ought to be. wont draw a conclusion cos i'm running it thru a discman. as for the physical construction of the speakers, they knock hollow from halfway to the bottom. viren says he hasnt damped it from middle to bottom for the bass factor. does this negatively affect sound? i really wont be able to tell unless i hear the same pair fully damped and rigid to the knock test. does it affect sound? not that i can discern. and yes they're light enough to be able to be shifted around easily so playing with placement is easier. in conclusion a good system if you're into music and are a 'musicophile' and there's nothing as soothing as watching the valves glow orange with all the lights off.. ahhhhh please do get tons of your favorite cds when you guys drop in! and yes 15 watts is loud enough for me! thanks once again for the cables and complimentary cds viren. really made it possible for me to hit the ground running :prost

Stevieboy,
I once used to play music through a discman connected to my amp some five years ago. My Onkyo cd changer had given up so I used this combo for a couple of months. The sound was terrible This is compared to a mid-fi grandpa -Onkyo cd player. A good cd player with a decent interconnect will make a tremendous difference to your system. Pick up an entry level Nad, Marantz or CA player and get one of Murthy’s interconnects. Reviewing a system as good as yours with a discman is terrible to say the least.

i know i know... wot to do. for the time being till mid march at least i'm stuck with it. was thinking of a nad c521bee. that it sounds amazing even with the discman is i guess tribute to the system.

Hi Steven,

Glad to see you're enjoying your music! May the system entice you to explore more avenues in music!

Certainly, the enjoyment will increase as you improve the source. The analog one is already on its way. When you look for the digital one, do consider the Marantz CD5001. Not only is it relatively (everything is relative!) inexpensive, it's also a good sounding machine. And, ask for my interconnect cables!

As far as the speaker cabinet construction goes, I'm of the light and rigid school. And from within that school, if the cabinet has to ring, at least make it sound musical!

All the best on your get-together.

Viren.

Hi Steve, glad you're happy with the system.
I'm with all those who recommended an early upgrade of the source-that & good interconnects make a huge, huge difference!If you feel you can hear more details now, wait till you hear the same tracks thru a good source/cables.
Hence,ask one of the forum members to bring along a good CDP & interconnects to ensure that the system will perform to its best for all you B'looru audiophiles.
And please,please list out the tracks you guys play,how they sound on your setup compared to theirs, etc.
Meanwhile, do break in your system by playing it everyday.And don't get too bothered by the knucle test etc-if it sounds good, it sounds good!
Looking forward to a detailed review of the meet.
Cheers & happy listening!

hi guys,

those of you who'd like to drop in this weekend round 4 onwards to listen the viren's gear, pm me with your email ids. will mail you a rough map and directions to my place.

have ordered the isolation transformer. hope it arrives before saturday.

Who is doing this isolation transformer for you ?

Square> it's by Murthy.

Stevie> does it condition the power?

nope for conditioning i use pantene pro v

seriously i think what it will do is take care of the noise that comes in thru the mains, and spikes etc. is that what you mean by conditioning als?

yes mr murthy is making it for me. its a standard 1:1 isolation transformer. 1kva rating.

Ok.

Stevie, I remember Murthy telling about bringing out a small power conditioner only for source components i.e, for CDPs, DVDPs etc. I thought you are getting the same!

Apply pantene pro v on all interconnects, spkr cables & powercords, it smoothens the sound quality

Pour some in both ears. It will remove the harshness too

guys please pm me your email ids so i can mail you the map i've drawn. actually a three part map right from mg road to my house with landmarks all the way. i've got just a couple of email ids so far. and i dont want to post the map on the forum!

hi guys,

have mailed you the directions. just to confirm, the list of those coming so if you havent received it, lemme know!

nagaraj
abhi
jochen (pmed you)
neitzche
als
soulforged
jazzypants (have to get your email still)
voodoochild
squarewave (hopefully can make it)

subboss? no news of him.

if anyone needs directions from koramangala or any other direction please feel free to pm me.

4 onwards i'm ready interconnects and cables welcome. will help me decide. cd player als and abhi are getting? i dont have the isolation transformer yet so if you think its safe only to play directly thru mains then get them. otherwise you guys can play it thru my dvd player with your interconnects.

see you all then on 3rd!

How I wish I were around for this... you'd have got some heavily modded Citypulse DA7.2x DAC goodness. Unfortunately I'm leaving for the US on friday morn :(.

Thats going to be quite a get together.
How I wish I could join in !
Guys, have a whale of a time, and remember-
a detailed write up of the meet, please!

Steve, thanks for the map. Try for isolation transformer from Murthy, incase not possible, try to borrow one small stabiliser for source component-CD player.

Any chance do you 've extra detachable powercord? My CD player's powercord I terminated with Hubbell plug - US type pins. If you 've multi pin socket which takes US type pins will also serve the purpose Or I've to re-terminate with Indian plug & then 've to change back to Hubbell. Or if some one has good shielded powercord, can bring along.

hopefully we have you for the next meet reign! you can always come over anytime to listen to the valves if you want to

sure kamal. will keep my notebook ready and take opinions down am not being funny. really gonna at least try and do as thorough a job as you did. and i'm sure there are going to be varied ones so its gonna be total fun hehe

als,

isolation he hasnt started! called him last evening he was waiting for confirmation from me cos he had not yet told me the rates. so two weeks from now only

i have a v-guard stabiliser i use for the tv. would that be enough? have also got a cheap 60 buck spike strip. yes i have a detachable power cord for my amp. i have a US to round pin converter plug. two of them.

Steve, that should be ok. I'll call you up later & discuss.

Damn..wish i could be at this meeting..

Savyasaachi schrieb:

Damn..wish i could be at this meeting.. :(

hmmm...we would miss you man..

yeah. wish you were here. a next time will come though

Steve,

Thanks for the map plus directions...guess you've taken quite an amount of time to get it done with all the turntable issues you're going through

I'm not sure what I can get, maybe some CDs? maybe my KOSS KSC-75 headphones if anyone's interested? maybe some cake and juices to keep the spirits flowing

Can I visit you sometime Stevie? I hope to visit Bangalore sometime this year.

Say, if any of you forum guys are visiting Chennai, you can PM me. I miss all the fun in this eternally quiet city

Hi Neutral, Next week I'll be in Chennai on some official duty & will stay for few days. Let's try to meet I'll PM you the details.

Voodoo_CHild schrieb:

Steve, Thanks for the map plus directions...guess you've taken quite an amount of time to get it done with all the turntable issues you're going through I'm not sure what I can get, maybe some CDs? maybe my KOSS KSC-75 headphones if anyone's interested? maybe some cake and juices to keep the spirits flowing :prost

hey just get your fav cds and yourself. everything else is on me any other stuff that anyone wants to get is always welcome however. hope everyone could read my writing. i wrote everything then figured the orientation was wrong. it from my house backwards so i did it again hehe. you can get your koss too. if its a relatively affordable one i'd like to check it out for future.

Neutral schrieb:

Can I visit you sometime Stevie? I hope to visit Bangalore sometime this year. Say, if any of you forum guys are visiting Chennai, you can PM me. I miss all the fun in this eternally quiet city :(

sure thing neutral! anytime. just lemme know a few days in advance.

ALS, if you happen to check out Neutral's Pulz RS 250, do let me know what you think of it. I am planning to pick one up...

Sure Soulforged. Though I travel often to Chennai, I couldn't make it, to meet our Chennai Audiophile friends:-)

Steve wrote:

other stuff that anyone wants to get is always welcome

Hmmm other stuff..Tomorrow is HOLY.....Colors

NO WAY!!!!! my valves are colorful enough. bright orange/reddish bhang would be good though dont know if you get it here...

just a final note guys. at the last signal (where you turn right, for those coming from mg road) (second signal after turning right from bannerghatta road for those coming from koramangala), vlcc comes on the left, go slow. cos the left turn off the main road after vlcc is partly hidden by trees and you might miss it. it comes up in a few seconds so stick to the left hand side.

if you miss the turn go ahead take the next left and left again. my house will be towards the end of the lane on the right hand side.

stevieboy schrieb:

just a final note guys. at the last signal (where you turn right, for those coming from mg road) (second signal after turning right from bannerghatta road for those coming from koramangala), vlcc comes on the left, go slow. cos the left turn off the main road after vlcc is partly hidden by trees and you might miss it. it comes up in a few seconds so stick to the left hand side. if you miss the turn go ahead take the next left and left again. my house will be towards the end of the lane on the right hand side.

This would probably go down as one of the most descriptive address/landmark narrations (those invited would agree with me )

Boy!...did you just go back today and walked down the lane to find the trees...

See you tomorrow

Cheers!

stevieboy schrieb:

NO WAY!!!!! my valves are colorful enough. bright orange/reddish bhang would be good though dont know if you get it here...

Psychedelic snack!?

Voodoo_CHild schrieb:

stevieboy schrieb: NO WAY!!!!! my valves are colorful enough. bright orange/reddish bhang would be good though dont know if you get it here... Psychedelic snack!? :D

I'm sure that the music would never look better

Voodoo_CHild schrieb:

stevieboy schrieb: just a final note guys. at the last signal (where you turn right, for those coming from mg road) (second signal after turning right from bannerghatta road for those coming from koramangala), vlcc comes on the left, go slow. cos the left turn off the main road after vlcc is partly hidden by trees and you might miss it. it comes up in a few seconds so stick to the left hand side. if you miss the turn go ahead take the next left and left again. my house will be towards the end of the lane on the right hand side. This would probably go down as one of the most descriptive address/landmark narrations (those invited would agree with me ) Boy!...did you just go back today and walked down the lane to find the trees... See you tomorrow Cheers!

if anyone gets lost after this, its at your own risk cos i dont know much about the area after my house

Steve wrote:

i dont know much about the area after my house

Something suspicious

BTW, I hope there is no power cut in your area today. Last Sunday in whole of Bangalore -East there was no power for more than 12hrs. If I'm not wrong, hereonwards all Bangaloreans will've power cuts during the weekends till the next monsoons.

hehe. nothing suspicious. just making sure all of you land up ok and get more listening time. power generally goes in the evening for half an hour, 8.30 or so. dont know about the day time. hope not!

hi guys,

all of you who came please do post your reviews/ opinions/ comments for the tracks you played. and please say whatever you want.

personally i prefer listening at half or lower that the loud volume that was being played. also my listening position is at an equilateral spot with the speakers. thus two things happen - cos of lower volumes i dont have any/hardly any boominess and room interactions are minimised cos i get more direct sound. there's far more nuance and detail i can make out in the sound this way.

with the position the speakers were at a lot of room interaction happened cos the seating position was also further away. als and abhi felt that more space was needed. equipment used was a nad 521 cd player, marantz cd 17 mkIII, audioquest interconnects (jaguar?)and power cords. siltech cables. manek's power cord.

i'm sorry kamal i wont be able to make a detailed post cos i was off to one side playing host there were quite a few guys crammed into my tiny place. but those who were in the middle please post on the music you listened to.

jochen - jennifer warnes
abhi - dire straits, callling elvis
als - patricia barber cafe blue
soulforged - gentle giants and the fruit thief (progressive rock)
vodoo child - unplugged, various,and i forget which other cd
nagaraj - monk
neitzche - indian classical

Good to know that all of you were able to get together. I was held up till six in the evening with some office work I’ll drop in one of these days and definitely take a listen.
Thanx for the invite Steve. Hope you all had fun.

Dear Stevieboy,

Nice get-together. For your taste and level, the set-up is ok.

Critical evaluation:

1.Amp lacks – power and bottom end punch
2.Mid is well pronounced
3.Highs – rounded off

Thanks for high tea.

Regards

jochen - jennifer warnes abhi - dire straits, callling elvis als - patricia barber cafe blue soulforged - gentle giants and the fruit thief (progressive rock) vodoo child - unplugged, various,and i forget which other cd nagaraj - monk neitzche - indian classical

Hi Steve,
Thanks for the round-off of the tracks played in the meet.
Also thank you for letting us all to play around with the system throughout the session. You are a nice host buddy.. .

I will try to jot down my short experience with Lyrita:

1. They look stunning. . Especially the speakers...standing 5ft tall and well finished real-wood veneer, they are actually worth the money even if they dont produce any sound

2. This was my first experience with single driver setup so I didnt know what to expect. I had heard that single drivers image and stage really well and they actually did it with Harmony-1. I would have loved to see them dissappear but I suppose the speakers need width and some depth from the rear wall to actually do the dissapearing act. For its size, 5ft distance between them is not enough I suppose. But even then they were imaging well.

3. Highs were lacking to my ears. Maybe I am a bit used to sparkling highs typical of a dome tweeter which didnt appear in the Harmonys but then I was told that single driver cannot be expected to do that. Infact Jochen told me that these fostex drivers sounded much better than whatever single drivers setup he had heard previously.
So I suppose its a compromise that can be lived with if one enjoys the other advantages of a single driver setup.

4. Bass...decent. Neither too punchy nor too thin. It was decent except for a bit of boominess which could be because of the extremely close proximity between the rear port and the ground. If the speakers are raised by around 6 inches using some platform, the boominess should easily dissappear.

5. Mids...this was one region that the setup excelled...as Steve had already mentioned, the sound of a Guitar comes out really nice. I particularly liked the track from R.E.M which had a lot of acoustic guitar tones. Female vocals sounded terrific. It was the mids which highly made up for the other weaknesses.

6. We also had some comparisions between Siltech and Audioquest Jaguar (with DBS) interconnects. In our case the Audioquest sounded better. To me the Audioquest gave a quieter background lushier midrange. We also compared ordinary power cords to Manek's power cord. The difference was quite immediate in the bass region. Tighter and more body to the bass IMO. Then we also compared the Philips DVDP to the entry level NAD C521 CDP . There was no competition at all. It was a clear illustration of how much music we miss when we listen through entry level DVDPs and also how much difference even a base level CDP can bring to the sound from any hifi. I hope Steve is listening .
Finally we connected the Marantz CD-17 MK-III which further cleaned up the sound. For the rest of the session we stuck to the Marantz .

7. As we ended the session and came out thinking about the system, I had this feeling, it was a very smooth sounding setup and is definitely a very good option for people setting up VFM hifi...but as Deaf once quoted: The sound that this combo offers can be bettered if the speakers are partnered with a different amp or if the amp can be partnered with a different speaker IMO.
Especially I loved the amp, though only 15 watts, if partnered with an efficient well designed 2-3 way speaker can match systems mutiple times the price. For 24k, this amp is just amazing. If one can choose the right speakers, this amp can do wonders IMO . That doesnt mean Harmonys were not good, it just means there could be a better combo.

Steve, thanks once again for inviting us over, we had a wonderful time listening to one of the better creations of the Indian hifi manufacturers. I may have to come again with my cousin to show him your setup

nietzsche schrieb:

Dear Stevieboy, Nice get-together. For your taste and level, the set-up is ok. Critical evaluation: 1.Amp lacks – power and bottom end punch 2.Mid is well pronounced 3.Highs – rounded off Thanks for high tea. Regards

hi neitzsche,

most welcome i tend to agree with you except to qualify the first point. valve amps do have less of slam than solid state. also since you mentioned you prefer listening at higher volumes, you'd most certainly prefer a higher powered amp. as for power well before you came in the whole floor was shaking literally! abhi was pumping it up! frankly i was quite surprised. hadnt matched those kind of volume levels with my limited source. highs yes, they do lack a little more 'sparkle', they're like a slight veil is over them. its very pronounced on my ac/dc live album. sounds a tad dull. thought it was my source but after the nad and marantz it was still there so i guess its the tradeoff against the benefits of the single driver. the bass improves if they're closer together. a position that's quite contrary to abhi and als' view

abhi they sound better closer together and with the chair closer too like i mentioned when you three first came in. i've tried all distances. the soundstage and bass is tightest about arms width apart if one stands in the center.

in retrospect what i should have done at the end should have been to position the speakers and chair in my normal position so everyone could take turns. a lot of the magic was missing. dunno why i didnt think of it anyway... your summary is pretty bang on.

[quote="abhi.pani"]

2. This was my first experience with single driver setup so I didnt know what to expect. I had heard that single drivers image and stage really well and they actually did it with Harmony-1. [/quote]

they disappear completely if you're sitting equilateral with the speakers closer together. the soundstage didnt sound as tight to me. then again personal preference i guess

[quote="abhi.pani"]
3. Highs were lacking to my ears. Maybe I am a bit used to sparkling highs typical of a dome tweeter which didnt appear in the Harmonys but then I was told that single driver cannot be expected to do that. Infact Jochen told me that these fostex drivers sounded much better than whatever single drivers setup he had heard previously.
So I suppose its a compromise that can be lived with if one enjoys the other advantages of a single driver setup. [/quote]

true. its something i have to sacrifice. that extra tingle in the highs...

[quote="abhi.pani"]
4. Bass...decent. Neither too punchy nor too thin. It was decent except for a bit of boominess which could be because of the extremely close proximity between the rear port and the ground. If the speakers are raised by around 6 inches using some platform, the boominess should easily dissappear.[/quote]

bass wasnt as tight cos they were further apart. also in that room i think the optimum spot is closer together. you wont get a wider soundstage like you guys prefer. more an intimate tight one. trust me. i started off that far apart and experimented with distance from cupboard too.

[quote="abhi.pani"]
5. Mids...this was one region that the setup excelled...as Steve had already mentioned, the sound of a Guitar comes out really nice. I particularly liked the track from R.E.M which had a lot of acoustic guitar tones. Female vocals sounded terrific. It was the mids which highly made up for the other weaknesses. .[/quote]



[quote="abhi.pani"]
6. We also had some comparisions between Siltech and Audioquest Jaguar (with DBS) interconnects. In our case the Audioquest sounded better. To me the Audioquest gave a quieter background lushier midrange. We also compared ordinary power cords to Manek's power cord. The difference was quite immediate in the bass region. Tighter and more body to the bass IMO. Then we also compared the Philips DVDP to the entry level NAD C521 CDP . There was no competition at all. It was a clear illustration of how much music we miss when we listen through entry level DVDPs and also how much difference even a base level CDP can bring to the sound from any hifi. I hope Steve is listening .
Finally we connected the Marantz CD-17 MK-III which further cleaned up the sound. For the rest of the session we stuck to the Marantz .[/quote]

no am not listening abhi there's such a big hole in my pocket you could drive a truck through it right now! seriously though the energy with your nad was amazing. the marantz was warmer but i think the nad had more bass definition. another tough choice to make. the audioquest was really good! bloody well made too. nice choice als.

[quote="abhi.pani"]
7. As we ended the session and came out thinking about the system, I had this feeling, it was a very smooth sounding setup and is definitely a very good option for people setting up VFM hifi...but as Deaf once quoted: The sound that this combo offers can be bettered if the speakers are partnered with a different amp or if the amp can be partnered with a different speaker IMO.
Especially I loved the amp, though only 15 watts, if partnered with an efficient well designed 2-3 way speaker can match systems mutiple times the price. For 24k, this amp is just amazing. If one can choose the right speakers, this amp can do wonders IMO . That doesnt mean Harmonys were not good, it just means there could be a better combo.[/quote]

as always personal preference hehe. would be interesting to mate the speakers with a solid state. the amp sound pretty good with the mordaunt short ms 902is. regarding the amp doing wonders with the right speakers, your choice is pretty limited cos its only 15 watts. the monitor audio had more defined highs but the harmony ones have more of that elusive 'magic' for me. am planning to get some different output tubes to roll. later.

Steve, thanks once again for inviting us over, we had a wonderful time listening to one of the better creations of the Indian hifi manufacturers. I may have to come again with my cousin to show him your setup [/quote]