The importance of a good cdp not to mention recordings.

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benkenobi
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#1 erstellt: 20. Apr 2005, 09:22

Hey guys,
the day i took my Nad over to mohan's place i decided that sionce i was removing my system i might as well take my H/K dvd player and give it a test run at Prithvi's place as i did not know any one else who had a decent cdp. i got out the H/K and we plugged it in with the Linn katan and the VDh revelations and the MF dual mono pre amps and i think the Bryston mono amps. we just played a couple of tracks(not completely) and then we switched over to the denon dvd2900.
the denon just sounded better than the H/K.
better imaging and sougstaging. the sound level also went up maybe a Db or a couple.
next we plugged in the Linn Classik.
it just devoured the denon and the H/K .
i mean u have to listen to all three to beleive the differnce a good cdp makes to a stereo setup.
i did this because i saw many of u post that i would get a huge improvement if i go in for a dediacted cdp. and i did not want to blindly beleive it and go buy a cdp.
this test we ran has clearded up any doubts that i have about the importance of a cdp.
Heard the cambridge 540c. sounded better than my H/K and immediately we plugged in the H/K back on my request and the sound level across the entire freq range dropped down . i mean everything sounded so dull.
well, that just blew away any resevations i had about cdp's.
Cheers,
Ben

big-ears
Stammgast

#2 erstellt: 20. Apr 2005, 09:45

Hey Benks,

Good to see you back.

The CDP is a very, very important component in the chain, as you have now discovered. A good amp and speakers can only output what is relayed to them by the source. If your CDP cannot pick up the minute details contained in the CD, what good is the best amp / speaker combination in the world?

As for the importance of recording quality, this simple credo explains it all – Garbage In, Garbage Out.

SUB_BOSS
Gesperrt

#3 erstellt: 20. Apr 2005, 09:46

vetry true dude..me too dyin for a CDP..may be will buy one first and an amp later......

Prithvi
Stammgast

#4 erstellt: 20. Apr 2005, 12:48

Guys,
I am glad that I was able to show some of you what the importance of a good CDP is over a crap DVDP.

ALso dont forget that recordings too make a big difference. No wonder I buy only xrcds from JVC, FIM and MOFI. Just can listen to indian cds anymore, but sometimes I forget quality if the music is very good.

After hearing and setting up two hi-end turntables and listening to LPs things have got worse. THe LPs just blow these latest formats. Just got a few XRCD LPs too.

Rgds

Prithvi

benkenobi
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#5 erstellt: 20. Apr 2005, 13:20

Prithvi schrieb:

Guys,
I am glad that I was able to show some of you what the importance of a good CDP is over a crap DVDP.

i would'nt call it crap.
yes it did sound very bad when compared to a dedicated cdp. but it is really an excellent dvd player .
but it does'nt measure up to a decent dedicated cdp.
in this regard it is yes like Prithvi said crap.

Ben

Aniruddha
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#6 erstellt: 20. Apr 2005, 13:35

Hi Prithvi,

Can you please send me the list of LPs?

Regards,
Aniruddha.

ravi
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#7 erstellt: 20. Apr 2005, 16:40

Benks, Was the CDP/DVDP connected from analog-out or digital-out?

benkenobi
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#8 erstellt: 20. Apr 2005, 16:51

analog

ravi
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#9 erstellt: 20. Apr 2005, 17:09

OK, then all bets cancelled

To be fair, I think they must be compared with the digital-out. Else it might be the $2 analog output stage in the DVDP that is limiting all the performance - we would not want to end up spending $$$ on a complete new eqpt when a simple digital connection might do wonders!

benkenobi
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#10 erstellt: 20. Apr 2005, 17:28

i think so too.
cause u see the yamaha sounds not all that bad . and i think its because am using a digital coaxial connection between them.
unfortunateley the Nad does'nt seem to have a digital in for me to check this out.
any suggestions on how i can resolve this.
Ben

Arj
Inventar

#11 erstellt: 20. Apr 2005, 20:31

most CDPs will not have a digital in. as in that case you will only be using the DAC part of the CDP.

if you get a separate DAC, and use your dvd player as a Transport you would usually get a better improvement than a CDP for the same price. (Usually DVD player if well damped make excellent transports)
Try getting a benchmark CDP (Around 900 USD) it apparently kills systems priced many times over.

Benks, if you can mnage it get a DAC and plug it into your CDP.you get better bang for the buck that way. maybe u can even try to DIY one

Betelguese
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#12 erstellt: 21. Apr 2005, 08:08

Hi guys!
Being a Absolute newbie and reading this posting. Don't all CDP/DVDP have an error correction code?
Do they also have a time correction code for the digital signals?
As far as whatever little knowledge I have Digitally the info is sent as ...001110011... .
And most of the Lens system and the ICs which go in the players are usually sourced from the same Chip factory in Taiwan or Korea. Probably it is the other solid state components like the resistors and capacitors and their quality controls which have an effect.

binoymehra
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#13 erstellt: 22. Apr 2005, 05:26

Any good budget DAC available in India?

ravi
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#14 erstellt: 22. Apr 2005, 08:29

betelguese,

You are right, all CDPs/DVDPs have an error correction code - the data that comes out is 100% accurate for any CDP/DVDP 99.999% of the time (the other 0.0001% is when there are extreme cases like heavy electrical interference from outside etc, in which case there owuld be audible drouputs). So all CDP/DVDP should theoretically sound alike. However the analog stage (DAC+pre-amp) limits the ultimate performance. DVDPs usually have a cheap analog DAC and preamp. CDPs score in this respect. However if we tap out the digital output directly in a DVDP and use a separate DAC or the DAC in AVR, then the sound would be comparable to any other CDP with a high quality DAC stage. The transport itself is much better in a DVDP (more precise and higher quality) than in a CDP.

abhi.pani
Inventar

#15 erstellt: 22. Apr 2005, 08:58

So, how do we tap the digital signal from the DVDP directly ? Is it through the digital out of the DVDP ?

Using an external DAC (I have not seen one yet), how do we feed the signal to the AVR finally.

How can we use the DAC inside AVR to convert the digital signal tapped directly from the DVDP ?

ravi
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#16 erstellt: 22. Apr 2005, 09:21

Abhi, relax

1. Tapping digital signal from DVDP - yes, through digital-out - either coaxial or optical
2. Using external DAC - connect the DVDP digital-out to external DAC digital-in
3. Using AVR's DAC - connect DVDP digital out to AVR diital-in

abhi.pani
Inventar

#17 erstellt: 22. Apr 2005, 09:33

Ok Relaxing....

How do we connect the DAC to the AVR ? What kind of output option it has ?

Secondly by using a DAC or the DAC of the AVR can we really get CDP quality sound from a DVDP (practically) ???

Somethings looks good on theory but fails to perform in practical use....so I am a bit skeptical about this...
Most of the audiophiles swear by dedicated CDP than going the DVDP + DAC way or DVDP + AVR (DAC) way,
Why is it ?

ravi
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#18 erstellt: 22. Apr 2005, 09:43

DAC output to AVR is analog RCA.

I think the dedicated CDP instead of DVDP+DAC is another of those debatable issues. I find no basis for the argument there - and no evidence that it "fails to perform in practical use".

abhi.pani
Inventar

#19 erstellt: 22. Apr 2005, 13:35

Other Big Guns,
Please throw some light on this.

benkenobi
Hat sich gelöscht

#20 erstellt: 22. Apr 2005, 15:31

This is again one of those debatable issues for which no single conclusion can be arrived on.
i think, ravi has summed up everything very clearly and precisely.
but regarding the outboard DAC u can try out google by serching for diy DACs or give me sometime and i'll give u some links which will help clear it up.
there is a very hot discussion which was taking place in diyaudio.com about the same thing.
i actually have already reffered it before in this forum.
Cheers,
Ben